Talk: Seat of the Triumvirate (instance)

Move

There is an uninstanced area called the Seat of the Triumvirate; while they're both the same, we should move the dungeon the the (instance) while keeping this article about that particular uninstanced area, list the mobs there, etc. The dungeon would be just about the dungeon while also listing all the mobs IN that dungeon. This uninstanced area is also where Vigilant Thanos can be found. — SurafbrovWowpedia administrator T / C 14:07, 22 March 2018 (UTC)

Nearly all instances are subzones of the zones they are in. The ones in Mists of Pandaria are even fully built in the overworld and visited during questing. Is this spot really so special?--SWM2448 17:53, 23 March 2018 (UTC)

Everything is special. — SurafbrovWowpedia administrator T / C 18:06, 23 March 2018 (UTC)

Not special enough to have the main page.--SWM2448 18:58, 23 March 2018 (UTC)

But can be made special enough; or at the least give information about the uninstanced zone (on the main page; include info about notable mobs, etc.) instead of the having just information about the dungeon itself. — SurafbrovWowpedia administrator T / C 00:17, 24 March 2018 (UTC)

What about starting a discussion / vote about separating the instances and their uninstanced areas? For similar reasons as Suraf mentioned, I tagged Dire Maul for splitting, it exists as an outdoor area visited during questing and it has enough lore (and will have a bit more with Chronicle 3 and maybe Traveler 3). --Mordecay (talk) 20:03, 23 March 2018 (UTC)

In the end I don't mind that much, but since it's always the same dumb people (aka me) doing the splits and moves, I'm getting kinda exhausted of them >.> Xporc (talk) 21:45, 23 March 2018 (UTC)

Then don't do it and wait for someone else to do it. 4Head — SurafbrovWowpedia administrator T / C 00:17, 24 March 2018 (UTC)

Uninstanced Dire Maul is the edges of the Broken Commons. Uninstanced Wailing Caverns is the Cavern of Mists. The NPCs that used to be by the door are at Wailing Caverns#Notes. Anything else is a footnote. Seat of the Triumvirate is (apparently) unique in that the back door needs to be its own page.--SWM2448 01:13, 24 March 2018 (UTC)

Very. Smile :) — SurafbrovWowpedia administrator T / C 05:08, 24 March 2018 (UTC)

@Sandwichman2448/@Surafbrov: No moves and deleted pages until you agree on something. Xporc (talk) 06:46, 4 April 2018 (UTC)

Not doing anything. Obviously something went wrong somewhere. Continue this discussion here: Forum:Uninstanced Subzones — SurafbrovWowpedia administrator T / C 06:55, 4 April 2018 (UTC)

Since the topic didn't advance at all in the past year, maybe it's time to merge Seat of the Triumvirate (instance) and Seat of the Triumvirate and put them simply at Seat of the Triumvirate? Xporc (talk) 09:34, 26 June 2019 (UTC)

Disagree, the instance should be separate from the subzone in the outdoor zone. Additionally, instance covers more than just the subzone. Just move the instance to Seat of the Triumvirate and the subzone to Seat of the Triumvirate (subzone). — SurafbrovWowpedia administrator T / C 11:03, 26 June 2019 (UTC)

Let's just throw a vote instead of wasting another year without any advances. Xporc (talk) 12:18, 26 June 2019 (UTC)

Subzone split vote

Should we merge the instanced Seat of the Triumvirate dungeon page and the uninstanced exterior's page? This will probably set a precedent for other cases like the Temple of the Jade Serpent.

Votes

Yes

1. Yes Xporc (talk) 12:18, 26 June 2019 (UTC) - (I don't believe there's enough content here to warrant a split. Usually an (instance) page is created when there is significant lore, but here the only difference I see between the indoor dungeon and the exterior subzone is a rare mob.)

1. Yes SWM2448 00:44, 28 June 2019 (UTC) - (What xporc said. It is also absurd that this is considered the less notable page.)

No

1. No — SurafbrovWowpedia administrator T / C 12:33, 26 June 2019 (UTC) - (The subzone should be completely separate from the instance and should be about the structure itself, like it is right now; they only need to be switched. The instance should contain information about what happens in said instance, contain information on loot tables, etc. The subzone should be located at Seat of the Triumvirate (subzone) while giving the main focus to the instance at Seat of the Triumvirate. Additionally, merging the two would only cause more confusion about the subzone / instance especially since the instance doesn't contain just the Seat of the Triumvirate subzone. Similarly, the Siege of Orgrimmar should be located at Siege of Orgrimmar (battle) while the raid should take the main un-disambig article because viewers looking up SoO are most likely looking up information about the raid, not the lore.)
2. No PeterWind (talk) 16:03, 26 June 2019 (UTC) - (I'm in agreeance with the general idea Surafbrov presents.)
3. No Mordecay (talk) 20:52, 27 June 2019 (UTC) - (Seat of the Triumvirate for subzone and Seat of the Triumvirate (instance) for instance.)

Comments

Let's first focus about the case of subzones/instances being split, stuff like the Siege of Orgrimmar (instances vs lore) can come later Xporc (talk) 12:38, 26 June 2019 (UTC)

I have no strong feelings on the split, but if it does remain split I'd much prefer to move the dungeon to the main namespace and use (subzone) for the other one. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 20:17, 27 June 2019 (UTC)

As I said, I'd prefer if we could talk about that later, or in another vote, in order to keep the goal of this one vote clear and focused :p Xporc (talk) 07:08, 28 June 2019 (UTC)

Bump Xporc (talk) 13:33, 2 July 2019 (UTC)

I don't have a particularly strong opinion on this, but I think I agree with Surafbrov. Also, I think it'd make more sense to have the lore about the place be on the dungeon page rather than the subzone, assuming that the latter gets moved to Seat of the Triumvirate (subzone) while the dungeon page takes priority. -- DeludedTroll (talk • contribs) 17:37, 4 July 2019 (UTC)

Looks like anyone that cared about this issue already voted, so even if the "outnumbering the other side by five votes" rule isn't respected, I'm closing down the vote. Seems like keeping subzone pages for individual dungeons won. Xporc (talk) 14:32, 9 July 2019 (UTC)

By one...--SWM2448 00:44, 20 July 2019 (UTC)

While it's nice to get sorted things ASAP, how much of a rush are we really in? PeterWind (talk) 01:00, 20 July 2019 (UTC)

DT's message was basically a No vote, and it's not like we were gonna get a sudden influx of fresh editors interested in this issue. Everyone that cared already voted, and I'm really tired of having some votes going on for literal years, so I sped things along. Xporc (talk) 10:42, 20 July 2019 (UTC)

(instance) or not instance

Should we keep the "gameplay" information on Seat of the Triumvirate (instance), while keeping the outdoor zone and lore information on Seat of the Triumvirate?

Votes

Yes

1. Yes Xporc (talk) 09:30, 16 July 2019 (UTC) - (For consistency with most of wowpedia (boss pages, item pages, etc.), I believe the gameplay page should be the disambiguated one.)
2. Yes Ryon21 (talk) 09:56, 16 July 2019 (UTC) - (We've been already talking about prioritizing lore over gameplay, especially since there are pages like Wowhead or WoWDB which specialize in that. This is why I'm so adamant in putting lore over gameplay.)
3. Yes Mordecay (talk) 11:33, 16 July 2019 (UTC) - (What Ryon says; other sites have better coverages of instances than wowpedia, so lets priroritize lore.)

No

1. No SWM2448 00:35, 17 July 2019 (UTC) - (Continuing what I said in Forum:Uninstanced_Subzones, we are not dealing with a lore page and an instanced dungeon page, we are dealing with a dungeon page and a subzone page. The subzone consists of a patio and a closed door, and is not even the entire structure. The more notable and important page in this case is the dungeon page. Yes, it is a lousy dungeon page, but the point still stands... and it shows there is not enough lore to warrant a split, lest the dungeon page get even smaller with its blurbs removed in an attempt to pad the other page.)
2. No Dark T Zeratul (talk) 02:49, 17 July 2019 (UTC) - (What Sandwichman said.)
3. No — SurafbrovWowpedia administrator T / C 04:13, 17 July 2019 (UTC) - (no comment)
4. No PeterWind (talk) 13:56, 30 July 2019 (UTC) - (My opinion is that the pages should be split, but that the dungeon should be the main page and the subzone should go under "(subzone)".)
5. No Yuvalal (talk) 10:10, 8 February 2020 (UTC) - (As far as i know most pages of intances has the lore in them. but there are many pages which i dong know of so depands on which is more common.)

Comments

This is gonna take another year before any decision is made ... Xporc (talk) 07:15, 17 July 2019 (UTC)

So, anyone willing to change his position or drop down the matter, or is it gonna be another eternal vote? I'm willing to remove my vote if that can finally move things Xporc (talk) 12:53, 30 July 2019 (UTC)